Category Archives: Podcast

Ep. 76 – Focusing on Obstacles with Gabriele Oettingen

By Noah Graff

Today’s guest on the podcast is Gabriele Oettingen, professor of psychology at NYU and author of the book “Rethinking Positive Thinking: the Science of Motivation.”

Contrary to conventional wisdom that asserts “positive thinking is always positive,” Oettingen’s studies have shown that people who embrace only positive thinking as a way to reach their dreams are often the least successful in achieving their goals.

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Gabriele’s strategy for success requires people to identify realistic, specific goals and then identify potential obstacles along the way. She calls it WOOP which stands for Wish, Outcome, Obstacle, Plan. I’ve used the strategy myself and I have to say it’s really worked for me.

Main Points

(4:10) Gabriele gives her story. She came from the field of behavioral biology, but later switched to psychology because she was interested in the concept of hope. She was interested in how people could keep going when they inherited difficult circumstances. She studied how people’s expectations determine their success. She found that when people had successful experiences in the past, they were often successful in achieving goals. She also found that people who had positive fantasies and daydreams not based on successful past experiences often did not achieve their goals.

(6:35) Gabriele defines expectations as judgements of how likely something will happen in the future, based on past experience. For example, she says a business owner with many years of past success will likely be successful in the future. However if a business owner has positive fantasies and daydreams about the business doing well despite having a poor past performance, the business probably will not do well in the future. Gabriele gives another example of a smoker imagining that he can reject a cigarette. If he hasn’t had good experiences trying in the past, he probably will fail. 

(8:35) Gabriele says that the general consensus around the world is that “positive thinking is positive” and that positive thinking will lead to more effort and more motivation. However her studies show that the more positively people think about the future the less well they do. The more positively people in weight loss programs fantasize about their success the fewer pounds they lose, while the people who permitted negative thoughts in their minds lose more weight. She said that tests on university students show that the students who fantasize the most positively about their job prospects are the least successful at getting employment when they graduate. This is due to them often studying less and sending out fewer job applications. 

(11:15) Gabriele says her research shows that the more people fantasize about having a relationship with someone they have a crush on the less likely they are to have one. Her research also shows that hip replacement patients who imagine their recovery to be the quickest are less successful in recovering than people with more moderate expectations. 

(13:20) Gabriele says that fantasies and daydreams hinder success because they cause people to expend less effort to reach their goals. She says her research also shows that the moods of people with positive fantasies and daydreams are worse in the long run than people with less fantasies and daydreams. The daydreamers’ moods were great initially, but in the long run they felt worse because their dreams did not come true. She says the problem is that positive fantasies and daydreams cause people to feel almost as if they have accomplished their ambitions. This takes away their energy.

(16:20) Gabriele says that the positive fantasies and daydreams are still important because they stem from people’s needs. They remind us of the voids in our lives we need to fill and give us motivation. If you are in a job you don’t like you start fantasizing about having a different job. If you are in a bad relationship you start fantasizing about being in a different situation. After you know what a problem is, then you can start to find a solution and go in a new direction. 

(19:10) Gabriele says the way to energize people so they can accomplish goals is to encourage people to identify the obstacles that hinder their ambitions. First this demonstrates to people they are not yet where they want to be. Then it helps them make a plan of action to get there. She calls this mental contrasting. 

(21:42) Gabriele says that imagining the obstacles that stand in the way of accomplishing goals triggers non-concious processes in the brain that cause behavior change. 

(22:10) Noah asks Gabriele’s opinion of when people say their belief in God helps them to reach their goals. Gabriele says in desperate circumstances where the obstacle in front of people seems insurmountable or is impossible to identify then thoughts and daydreams might be more useful than mental contrasting, because it at least they can provide hope. But she says in cultures and circumstances in which people have freedom and the ability to chart their own paths mental contrasting is the best option to succeed as well as decide which goals are most sensible to go after.

(26:50) Gabriele explains WOOP, a framework used to assist people with implementing mental contrasting. WOOP stands for Wish, Outcome, Obstacle, Plan. The framework helps people formulate ways overcome potential challenges, by utilizing the mindset: “If I meet obstacle (X) then I will do the behavior (Y) in order to overcome it.” The thought process non-consciously makes people behave in a way that enables them to fulfill their wishes. Noah brings up the free WOOP app that assists people with mental contrasting, which he has used many times to accomplish his goals. 

(29:15) Gabriele suggests that people go to the www.woopmylife.org to learn about mental contrasting before using the phone app. Noah says that he will do a demonstration of the WOOP app, assisted by Gabriele, in a video on the Today’s Machining World website (to be released shortly).

Question: Do you usually think about obstacles when you set a goal?

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Ep. 75 – Using Blockchain in Manufacturing with Jim Regenor

By Noah Graff

Today’s guest on the podcast is Jim Regenor, founder of Veritx, a company which helps clients dramatically reduce lead times and increases readiness for military and airline customers with blockchain technology.

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With today’s 3-D printing technology parts can be produced on site so clients don’t need to wait for products to be sent by land or sea. All that needs to be sent is the digital information for how to produce the parts on site. Blockchain insures the digital information is correct.

Main Points

(3:30) Jim gives background on his company Veritx which he established in August of 2019. He characterizes the company’s product as “a digital parts catalog for regulated industries that reduces long lead times and increases readiness for military and airline customers.” 

(4:35) Jim talks about a proof of concept with the Department of Defense where blockchain could reduce the lead time for an F-15 part from 265 days down to 6 hours from order to delivery. He says that the United States military still uses some aircraft from as far back as the 1950s, so being able to deliver spare parts efficiently can be difficult when many of the original aerospace suppliers have gone out of business. 

Jim Regenor, founder of Veritx

(8:00) Jim gives his background. He spent 31 years as a pilot in the U.S. Air Force. He was on the Security Council for the Bush and Obama Administrations, and he also ran a large logistics operation, with 15 locations in 11 countries across three continents—many of them war zones. He said he was moving roughly 570,000 tons of cargo and about 2 million people a year, and found himself constantly needing spare parts. 

(9:25) After he got out of the Air Force, Jim ran the military aftermarket division at a Tier 1 aerospace company called Moog Aircraft Group. The company had acquired a 3-D Printing business in Michigan and realized that 3-D printing would become an enabler for digital 4.0 schema and how industries would interact. This led him to world of blockchain.

(11:00) Jim says that 3-D printing coupled with blockchain enables what he calls the fourth modality of logistics. Instead of transporting physical parts by land or sea, digital information to make the parts is sent on the cloud. Then parts are manufactured on site with 3-D printing. Blockchain enables the information to be sent properly.

(14:10) Jim characterizes blockchain as a distributed ledger. He gives an example of several people in a room in which one person owes another person 10 dollars. Every person records that 10 dollars is owed in their ledgers. If the person who owes money tries to lie and says he only owes 9 dollars, the people in the room have records to prove he lying. This concept means that information can be sent through a decentralized transparent system and cannot be corrupted. All records are transparent so that there is a consensus. For blockchain applications, sometimes hundreds or thousands of computers keep the ledger. This can be used to establish value for cryptocurrencies such as Bitcoin, but it can also work well for other applications such as logistics because it enables people to track the entire lineage of an asset.

(17:20) Jim gives an example of Walmart using blockchain to track the supply chain of its lettuce from harvest to store shelves to combat the E. coli problem last year.

(19:00) Jim says that many companies are using blockchain right now and data can be tracked with user interfaces. He says for the supply chain for aerospace blockchain records the entire process, starting with the initial requirements being sent to a designer. Then each stage such as the design of a part, manufacturing, quality control, etc. is recorded individually. Everything is transparent and correct, insuring a good final product. If people realize there is a design flaw, it is easy to go back and find the mistake because each stage has been recorded with blockchain. 

For more information about Veritx go to veritx.co or email Jim Regenor at jim@veritx.co.

Question: What’s your experience using blockchain?

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Ep. 74 – Getting Young People Into Manufacturing with Terry Iverson

By Noah Graff

Our guest on today’s show is Terry Iverson, co-owner of Iverson and Company and author of a new book called Finding America’s Greatest Champion: Building Prosperity Through Manufacturing, Mentoring and the Awesome Responsibility of Parenting.

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Terry and his family have been in the machine tool and production business for almost 100 years, specializing in Hardinge equipment. In writing this book, Terry draws upon his vast network of professionals in a variety of businesses to understand how mentorship and apprenticeship can rebuild American manufacturing. 

Main Points

(4:00) Terry says his book’s main message is that with better mentoring and parenting the United States could fix its problem of the skills gap in manufacturing.

(5:15) Terry talks about the origins of his family’s machinery business. In 1925, his grandfather went to work at Hardinge. He started sweeping floors, but soon climbed the ladder in the business because of his engineering acumen. He started his own business in 1931 selling and rebuilding Hardinge machines. Terry’s father joined the business, and his uncles started their own production shop. After spending six years getting his mechanical engineering degree, Terry joined the business about 40 years ago, though he was reluctant at first.

(9:25) Terry says he sees his book as a way to give back to the industry that has been so good to him and his family. He says over the span of his career his clients have told him more and more that they can’t find enough skilled people. He hopes that his book helps to change the culture of education in the United States from one that only encourages expensive 4-year colleges that result in horrible student debt. Terry says he credits his own success in life to having lots of great mentors such as teachers, coaches, and family friends.

Terry Iverson, author of Finding America’s Greatest Champion: Building Prosperity Through Manufacturing, Mentoring and the Awesome Responsibility of Parenting

(11:15) Terry says mentors are valuable because they can use their experience to guide young people, to help them find the best ways to succeed. He says that while there is nothing wrong with college, it is a pity that young people are not also exposed to manufacturing trades. He says that more mentors and parents who are aware of potentially fulfilling and lucrative careers in manufacturing can help change this trend. Terry says that the manufacturing industry in the United States hasn’t advocated enough for itself, whereas in many European countries manufacturing jobs are highly regarded by society. Terry sites a stat that if the U.S. manufacturing economy was ranked among manufacturing economies of other countries it would be ranked 8th in size. 

(18:20) Terry says that apprenticeship programs in the United States began disappearing in the late 1980s, but today he is starting to see a comeback. He says part of the reason the apprenticeship programs disappeared was that U.S. companies were thinking only of the short-term bottom line, in contrast to European companies that take a more long-term business strategy. He says in Germany manufacturing companies typically have 10 percent of their workforce as apprentices, meaning a company of 200 workers would have 20 apprentices, etc. He says the German American Chamber of Commerce is working hard to bring back the trend of apprenticeship programs.

(21:30) Terry says he hopes that as the manufacturing industry becomes more computerized and automated, that computer savvy young people will be attracted to it. 

(24:40) Terry says that young people in Europe know what they are passionate about in their teens. He feels that more internships and programs that expose American young people to a variety of careers could help build a skilled workforce in manufacturing, as well as other fields in the United States. 

(29:00) Terry talks about a 17-year-old intern he had at his own business who was interested in engineering. She had an idea for a device that tested for concussion protocol. Terry contacted a friend from high school who was a biomedical engineer who helped her get a pending patent. She went on study engineering at the University of Illinois.

(31:20) Terry says to go to Championnow.org for information to buy his book. He is offering a special discount to listeners of Swarfcast.

Question: What made you choose a career in manufacturing?

 

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Ep. 73 Assessing Your Machine’s Performance with Eric Fogg

By Noah Graff

Our guest on today’s show is Eric Fogg, co-founder and head of machine connectivity at MachineMetrics. MachineMetrics produces a device that connects directly with machine tool PLCs and controls to track realtime and historical data on equipment. Operators use the data to assess how machines are truly performing, which is often quite different from what they perceive.

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Main Points

(3:10) Eric explains that MachineMetrics is a machine data connectivity data platform. The company makes a device (he calls an “edge device”) that connects directly to machine controls and sensors of production equipment. The device gathers valuable data on how the machines are performing and sends it to operators to analyze.

(4:10) Eric talks about taking machine shop classes in high school. During high school he worked at a lot of different machine shops on nights and weekends and taught himself programming.

(7:00) Eric says that MachineMetrics can gather data from all vintages of machine tools, not just CNC machines, though CNC machines provide the most data. He says right now MachineMetrics has a client using its edge device to gather data from a punch press that was manufactured in 1925. He says, “As long as it moves and has electrons flowing through it we can probably get some useful data out of it.”

(10:00) Eric says that in college he majored in theology because he wanted to work in the field of corporate ethics. Eventually he started his own machine shop in his mid 20s that specialized in green technology products.

Eric Fogg of MachineMetrics

(14:00) Eric says that when the 2008 recession hit he started doing more job shop type work with low margins. He eventually closed his company started doing Six Sigma consulting for job shops in Vermont. The experience of analyzing the processes of different shops inspired the idea for MachineMetrics. He says he observed that shops were often making decisions based on a gut feeling rather than based on data. He came up with the idea to pull the data that already was on the machines’ controls to create reports, dashboards and analytics to help machining companies make decisions.

(20:25) Eric says the most basic data MachineMetrics tracks is machine utilization—how much machines are running versus how much people think they are running. He says the average perceived utilization of equipment by MachineMetrics’ customers is just under 80%. The actual average is in the high 20 percents to low 30 percents (the numbers are based on active shifts). He says that the numbers can be surprising as various markets differ. For instance, he says for some types of very low volume work (1 or 2 part runs) 15% utilization might be considered world class. He says for high volume shops utilization is often much higher. For instance, he says shops making millions of parts with much thinner margins sometimes have utilization in the 90 percents. He says that no matter what type of shop, clients are usually surprised at their utilization rates.

(24:10) Eric gives some examples of how MachineMetrics data uncovered problems that led to low machine utilization. He gives an example of a client who was using cheap 1/4” drill bits on a drill and tapping center. The company calculated it took only 5 minutes to change a drill bit out, so they used cheaper ones with short tool life. The problem was that while operators left to get a new drill bit from the tool crib they got sidetracked and the average time to change the drill bit was actually over 40 minutes. After learning this the owner of the company decided to go out and buy the most expensive drill bit that lasted 10 times longer than those he was using. It was a solution that was much faster and easier to implement then changing the procedure in the shop which could have tons of variables to consider.

(27:40) Eric says that MachineMetrics generally does not advise customers how to use the data they collect. He has found that customers usually take the initiative to solve their problems. He says his company is often surprised at the interesting ways that clients utilize the data.

(30:15) Eric discusses a phenomenon he sees in CNC shops he calls “cyclecreep.” What happens is that over time people gradually alter they way they run jobs by making tweaks such as changing tools or feed rates which often increases cycle time. The problem is that the manufacturer continues to bill its customer for the original cycle time. Operators see green lights on machines which makes them think everything is running fine but problems are occurring behind the scenes.

(35:30) Eric gives an example of a company running the same parts on 20 vertical machining centers that were bought over 10 years. MachineMetrics found that no two machines had the same original cycle time of 40 minutes. He says that some cycle times only differed a few seconds but the delta between fastest machine and the slowest machine was 15 minutes. After seeing this data, in just a week the company was able to adjust the machines to all have a cycle time within a few seconds of each other.

(37:25) Eric says it can be difficult for his clients because often MachineMetrics is delivering them bad news. He says that the consistent trend he sees is that the most successful shops have a culture around change.

Question: Are the effects of the coronavirus a net plus or a net minus for your machining business?

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Ep. 72 – Coronavirus and the Supply Chain with Daniel Hearsch

By Noah Graff

On today’s podcast we’re delving into a topic that’s been on many people’s minds these days, the coronavirus.

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Our guest is automotive supply chain expert Dan Hearsch, Managing Director at AlixPartners. Dan is briefed daily by his associates in China about how people in manufacturing are dealing with the coronavirus. FYI, this interview was conducted one week ago on Feb. 26, 2020.

Main Points

(2:55) Dan gives his background working in the automotive industry for OEMs, as well as Tier 1 and Tier 2 suppliers. Today he is a consultant, focusing on supply chain and procurement projects.

(3:55) Dan says many people have been comparing the coronavirus, also known as Covid-19, to SARS, the last serious epidemic in Asia back in 2003. He says the big difference between the SARS outbreak and the current one is that in 2003, China was roughly only 4% of global GDP, while today China has a much more significant role in the global supply chain and its own internal economy is much larger than it was 17 years ago.

(5:30) Dan says one of the hardest things about the coronavirus outbreak is knowing what the local response is going to be. He says that it seems like the quarantine policies in China, Korea, and Italy are the correct response.

(6:00) Dan says he’s briefed daily on the latest news in China from his associates in there. The news is based on what they are seeing from the Chinese government and what they are seeing in real time from the companies with whom they work.

Daniel Hearsch of AlixPartners

(6:55) Dan says he hears there is a decreased incidence of new coronavirus cases and the death numbers seems to be falling, which makes people hopeful that business will get better soon. He says the worst thing to do is to send people back to work too soon because they could get sick again and the quarantine process would have to start over.

(7:40) Dan says the Chinese New Year amplified the spread of the coronavirus because of all the people traveling back to their homes in the countryside. However, he said that from a business standpoint the Chinese New Year was helpful because people who buy goods from China were already planning for an eight day shut down. People had planned to have extra material already in transit on the water, but had not planned for further delays.

(9:40) Dan says the majority of factories in China that were down have opened up again. He sites a Chinese government survey of 982 enterprises that said 41% had resumed by February 14 and predicts over 80% should be back up and running this month. He says the biggest problems relate to transportation and workforce issues because a significant number of people are quarantined or have trouble traveling. His sources say that Chinese manufacturers in the survey are running at only 30-40% of their potential productivity. The Chinese government is comparing the current electricity usage in various industrial areas to past years to gage productivity. It found that the level of usage was about 57% that it was at this same time of year in 2018 and 2019.

(12:15) Dan says that the automotive sector has a very lean supply chain, meaning companies hold very little safety stock, which makes it vulnerable to the decrease in supplier productivity.

(16:40) Dan says that some North American manufacturing companies are going shorten their supply chains as China, Korea, and Italy can’t supply enough parts. He says this trend would lend itself to machining processes that are fast to set up. He says capacity shouldn’t be a big problem because the domestic automotive market has been down of late.

(18:50) Dan says China has both a supply and a demand problem because many of the domestic customers who buy parts are also closed. This differs from the United States that only has a supply problem because companies are still purchasing goods and consumers are still buying.

(20:40) Dan says that many of the large scale supply chain problems caused by the coronavirus are not new. He draws a comparison to the aftermath of the Fukushima nuclear power plant disaster in 2011, which exposed the problems that occur when companies have too many suppliers concentrated in one region and do not have enough relationships with backup suppliers.

(23:45) Noah asks if the pharmaceutical supply chain in China has similar issues as automotive. Dan says the problems are probably similar. He says the transportation issues could be significant as suppliers try to catch up on a backlog of shipments, though he predicts the production processes might not be as labor intensive as those of automotive.

(27:45) Dan says that the coronavirus is a common type of virus—the same type of virus as the common cold. He says the Covid-19 epidemic is quite contagious and has a high fatality rate of 2.5-3% compared to .05% for typical flu. He says limiting personal contact with other people and washing hands regularly is the best practice to protect oneself against the virus. He says that a lot of people make mistakes such as wearing the wrong type of protective masks and wearing a mask more than one time.

(31:20) Dan says if the United States has an outbreak the impact on its economy shouldn’t be as dramatic as China’s. A higher percentage of people have the ability to work remotely while quarantined because a smaller percentage work in factories. Still, he admits an outbreak will still significantly affect the domestic supply chain.

(33:30) Dan says out of China’s study of 982 surveyed Chinese companies 42% of those enterprises will run out of cash in the next three months and 10% will run out of cash in one month because they can’t cover their fixed costs. He says it is likely the Chinese government will act as a safety net, though he is not familiar with the bankruptcy laws there.

(36:40) Dan says the best case scenario is that the most problematic countries get the Covid-19 epidemic under control and it doesn’t become a global pandemic. He says it is possible that in 4 to 5 months most suppliers will be back up to speed in the problematic countries.

(38:25) Dan says the precautionary health measures by governments seem to be the correct plan to deal with the coronavirus epidemic. He says saving people’s lives is more important than keeping factories running, not just for humanitarian reasons, but also for long-term business success.

(39:30) Dan says it is vital for manufacturers to set up alternate suppliers as soon as possible to prepare for a pandemic or other supply chain setbacks.

Question: Have you noticed supply chain interruptions due to the coronavirus affecting your business?

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Ep. 71 – Selling Wickman Multi-Spindles with David Taylor of Machine Tool Spares

By Lloyd and Noah Graff

Our guest on today’s podcast is David Taylor, owner of Machine Tool Spares, one of the world’s most respected rebuilders of Wickman multi-spindle screw machines.

Machine Tool Spares is based in Coventry, England, the birthplace of Wickman machine tools. His company turnkeys Wickmans and sells Wickman spare parts all over the globe. David shared his views on the role of cam multi-spindles and Great Britain in today’s machining industry.

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Main Points

(3:00) David talks about his company, Machine Tool Spares. The company provides Wickman multi-spindle spare parts, service, rebuilt and turnkey machines around the world. He says the company’s mission is to keep the Wickman cam machines relevant in the modern world. He says his company stretches the capabilities of the machines to do applications never achieved before using Wickman cam machines.

(5:00) David says that Machine Tool Spares is the independent alternative to Wickman Group, also located in Coventry, England.

(6:30) David says Wickman usage in the UK is continuing to decline. He this is due to less people with skills to run the machines, and because people are put off by the length of changeover time between jobs on the machines. David says his company is finding growth in India, Europe, and Scandinavia.

(11:00) David says Machine Tool Spares is doing much less selling of machines in “as-is” condition and more rebuilt and turnkey machines for customers’ specific applications. He says customers have higher standards for parts and want to buy machines that are ready to make high quality, consistent parts as soon as the machine arrives on their floor, so every machine that is shipped out is tested for accuracy.

(12:15) Lloyd and David marvel at how old Wickman machines in poor condition continue to run good parts for decades. David attributes this to how robust Wickmans are.

(13:30) David says that customers in India are becoming more sophisticated and wanting to buy higher quality machines, rather than purchasing equipment primarily based on price. He talks about an unusual turnkey job Machine Tool Spares sold to India in which a company needed to machine a forged part.

(18:00) David says that often he has seen companies running very expensive CNC multi-spindles on certain simple jobs that a cam multi-spindle could easily handle. He says Machine Tool Spares does not retrofit Wickmans with CNC capability. Instead the company sometimes engineers customized attachments to accomplish complicated operations.

(12:40) David talks about another business he has a share in, a CNC Swiss shop running Citizens.

(22:30) David says Machine Tool Spares has not sold much equipment in China but has supplied Wickman spare parts there. He says even though that market is growing, his company hasn’t pursued it because it would require considerable resources.

David Taylor, Owner of Machine Tool Spares

(24:45-31:30) David talks about Brexit. He says that for the next year everything will stay the same in the UK, but next year Britain’s relationship with continental Europe could dramatically change depending on how the new trade deal is negotiated. He says that the EU is much more experienced at negotiating trade deals than Britain, which hasn’t negotiated a new trade deal independently in 40 years. He says he is pretty worried about the deal’s conclusion. In a worse case scenario he says he would even consider moving part of his company’s spare parts business into a facility in continental Europe.

David says the Brexit negotiation could dramatically effect Britain’s  supply chain. He gives an example of a Nissan plant in northeast England, which has historically been one of the most productive car plants in Europe. He says Nissan holds half a day of stock there. It uses 5 million parts per day, 60% of which are imported. He says that if importing material into Britain becomes a slow and difficult process, businesses like Nissan may leave.

David says Brexit has significantly depreciated the British Pound. This is has been good for the country’s exports, but has disrupted the country’s imports.

(33:10) David says he enjoys Swarfcast because it’s nice to hear people talk about our industry. He says when he goes to dinner with friends he describes himself as “the dinosaur.” He says he is in a world his peers don’t understand because they don’t have the privilege of working with machines that are 40 to 50 years old.

Question: Can you make good money with old screw machines?

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Ep. 70 – Machine Tool Building with Michele Tajariol of TAJMAC ZPS, Part 2

By Lloyd and Noah Graff

Today’s podcast is part two of an interview we did with Michele Tajariol, co-owner and Vice President of TAJMAC-ZPS, one of the world’s most prominent producers of multi-spindle screw machines. In the interview Michele gives his take on the competitive market of European multi-spindle brands. He also shared his experiences selling machines to China and India.

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Main Points of the Interview

(2:30) Michele says that when his family’s company TAJMAC purchased ZPS 20 years ago, it was only familiar with the the company’s multi-spindles. Michele says that he and his family knew very little about the other machines the company produced, such as CNC machining centers and gantry bed mills, and they knew only a little bit about the company’s foundry.

(3:20) Michele discusses the world multi-spindle market, saying that swings in demand for the machines are often volatile and unpredictable. He says that a year and half ago ZPS couldn’t produce enough machines, but currently the market is soft. He says sales of machines can change 50 percent or more from one year to the next. He says that the business has to be prepared to adapt to both high demand and low demand for machines. Michele says that though the multi-spindle business has gone soft right now, the machining center business is good because of strong manufacturing in lower volume sectors.

(6:55) Michele says that upper management of automotive companies seem as though they are not totally sold that electric cars will dominate the car market in the near future. One trend he is noticing is that younger people in Europe don’t want to own cars and instead use car sharing services. He says he thinks there will be a lot of demand for self-driving cars in the coming years.

Michele also says that people have not proven electric cars are better for the environment than standard gasoline models and thinks that diesel is probably good for the environment despite critics. He says that so many unknown factors are making car buyers indecisive. He says that people running multi-spindle screw machines for parts in internal combustion engines don’t know which production equipment to invest in going forward.

(11:20) Michele says machining centers are selling well now to produce batteries for electric cars. The machines are used to mill the cages that hold the batteries in cars and trucks. He says that he has no desire to buy an electric car himself.

(12:45) Michele says that a few years ago TAJMAC-ZPS chose to keep making a lot of cam-driven multi-spindle models in addition to building CNC multi-spindles. He says it was a move contrary to the other European multi-spindle producers who stopped making Cam machines entirely or greatly reduced their production of them. He says this has been a great business move because there are still a lot of end users making parts that don’t require CNC technology. He says that the price of a new ZPS cam multi-spindle will range from 400,000 Euros to nearly 1 million Euros. The price of ZPS CNC multi-spindles range from 600,000 Euros to nearly 2 million Euros, depending on the size and capability of the machine.

(15:35) Noah asks Michele to compare ZPS’s CNC multi-spindles to those of its competitors. He says a 6-spindle with the top configuration offers a higher configuration of driven axes and linear axes than its competitors. 

(16:20) Michele says the leader in CNC multi-spindle machines is INDEX. He says Schutte is steadily selling less machines, Gildemeister is just now rebooting its CNC multi-spindle. He says Tornos has had lots of ups and downs over the last 20 years, but their newest CNC multi-spindles have good technology because they redesigned their machines so recently.

(19:30) Michele discusses ZPS’s experience selling to the Chinese market. He says in China many companies opt to choose Swiss style machines over multi-spindles because they feel more comfortable than the multi-spindles despite them being more efficient. In contrast, Europe’s labor is expensive and its buildings are often small, so multi-spindles are the best choice for European manufacturers.

(21:40) Michele says that in India the price of a new multi-spindle is out of a typical machining company’s price range, so companies there opt to buy used or rebuilt multi-spindles. He says the Indian machining market is growing and companies there often have a better knowledge of multi-spindles than those in China.

(23:10) Michele says that believes China’s manufacturing industry will still be superior to India’s in the foreseeable future. He says China is unrecognizable from when he first went there 20 years ago, while India still seems much the same.

(25:45) Michele says think that in China people don’t have enough freedom but in Western Europe people have too much freedom and take their freedom for granted. He says that in China it seems like people are happy, while many Europeans and Americans complain that their standard of living has fallen.

(28:00) Michele says that luck has played a big role in his life. He feels grateful to have grown up in a good family in Italy and that he has had a lot of good career opportunities of which he has taken good advantage.

Question: Do you do business in India?

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Ep. 69 – Life of a Machine Tool Builder with Michele Tajariol

By Lloyd and Noah Graff

Today’s guest on Swarfcast is Michele Tajariol, an old friend of ours and co-owner of TAJMAC-ZPS, one of the world’s most prominent producers of multi-spindle screw machines.

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In the interview, Michele discussed how his family’s business grew from a used machine tool dealer in Italy into a diversified multi-national machine tool builder. He also recounted his career path, first working with his father in Milan, followed by a short stint in Chicago working at Graff-Pinkert, and finally moving to the Czech Republic where he became the manager of ZPS’s factory.

Main Points of Interview

(5:10) Michele talks about the history of his family’s business. Tajmac was started by his grandfather Amadeo in the 1930s, producing mechanical lathes during World War II. Later, Amadeo became a rebuilder of single spindle machines, and sold used turning equipment. Michele’s father Andrea and his uncle, who would later leave the company, joined Tajmac. In the ‘90s, Tajmac began distributing new multi-spindle machines from ZPS a Czech machine tool builder. The company sold machines in Italy, Germany and the United States. (In the United States during that time ZPS multi-spindles were known as Euroturns).

(6:55) In the early ‘90s, Tajmac bought Wickman, the British multi-spindle builder, when it went bankrupt. It was Tajmac’s first experience producing new machine tools. In 2000 Tajmac bought ZPS. The company was in financial trouble, and Michele’s father liked the rigidity of the machines and the price.

(9:45) Michele says his father taught him the importance of loving your job, even if the job wasn’t your original dream. Also he says it’s important to do a job in the manner you like so you can continue to do it longterm.

(11:30) Michele talks about his experience coming to work Graff-Pinkert in 1999. At age 22 Michele had been working at Tajmac for three years. Lloyd Graff suggested to Michele’s father that it would be an interesting experience for Michele to try working in the machinery business in the United States for three weeks. He ended up remaining in the United States for four months. Michele enjoyed working at Graff-Pinkert where he felt a similar familial atmosphere to Tajmac, he enjoyed Chicago and he also met a girl in the city.

Michele Tajariol, Co-owner of TAJMAC-ZPS

(15:10) Michele talks about joining his family’s business. He said his father never put pressure on him to work at Tajmac. Michele did not like going to college in Milan where he only attended school for one year. He needed to work somewhere, and the machinery business seemed like a opportunity.

(16:20) Michele talks about how he came to work at the ZPS factory in Zlin, Czech Republic. The first manager Tajmac hired to run ZPS didn’t work very well for the first year or so. At 25 years old, Michele went to Zlin with some friends for a holiday weekend. He loved the city and was single, so he decided it was a good opportunity to live and work there. After a short time working at ZPS, the second general manager the company had hired was also unsuccessful. Michele then decided it was best for him to try running the company.

(22:30) Michele says he thinks he is just an “OK general manager” but considers himself a “good owner” who knows multi-spindles well. After 20 years he says he finally feels that he has a decent proficiency in the Czech language.

(24:30) Michele talks about all of the types of machines the TAJMAC-ZPS produces at its factory in Zlin. The company produces multi-spindles, Manurhin sliding headstock machines, CNC machining centers (multipurpose, horizontal and vertical), and gantry bed mills. It also builds plastic injection molding machines for Negribossi. The company also has its own foundry.

He says the most profitable machines the company builds are its multi-spindle screw machines, but those machines also take the most skilled labor and engineering because they are so complicated.

(27:20) Michele says ZPS is one of the only machine tool companies that makes every part in its machines starting with the casting. He says this is not the best business model, but it produces the best quality machines.

Question: Do you prefer to buy new or used machine tools?

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Ep. 68 – Starting a Swiss Shop with Dulio Arellano

By Noah Graff

Today’s podcast is an American Dream story. Our guest is Dulio Arellano, owner of Premier Swiss, a Tornos shop in Addison, Illinois, which he founded in 2017. Dulio came to the United States from Mexico when he was 18 years old.

After working in various machine shops, Dulio got a job as a technician at Tornos USA. At Tornos, Dulio developed skills and relationships that gave him the foundation to start his own business at the age of 34.

Scroll Down to Listen to the Podcast

Main Points of the Interview:

(3:20) Dulio discusses his company, Premier Swiss, a job shop with three Tornos Swiss lathes, a DECO10, DECO13, and DECO20.

(4:25) Dulio talks about immigrating to the United States from Mexico when he was 18 years old in 2001. His father had already been in the United States for years, but the immigration process took a long time. 

(6:00) Starting at age 20, Dulio worked for eight years at a company that makes pressure pipes. While working there, his older brother repeatedly told him that he should look into a career in CNC machining. It took his brother independently enrolling Dulio in a CNC machining class to get him to try it.

Dulio Arellano, Owner of Premier Swiss

(9:30) After working in CNC machine shops for several years, Dulio landed a job as a technician at Tornos. While at Tornos he learned about the latest Tornos equipment. Just as importantly, he also made a lot of close contacts in the Swiss business.

(10:10) After four years working at Tornos, Dulio knew that he wanted to eventually go into business for himself. One day he went to a customer to give a training class. The customer told him that he had a used DECO10 for sale and asked him if he knew someone who would be interested in buying it. Dulio bought the machine at a bargain price in the low $20,000s.

(14:10) Dulio’s first challenge was to find a place to put the machine. He rented a heated 5-car garage on Chicago’s westside for $500 per month that he found on Craigslist. The business later moved to St. Charles, IL.

(19:00) While continuing to work at Tornos, Dulio started experimenting making a few parts he hoped to sell online, such as an arrowhead he had seen on eBay that was made in China. 

(21:00) On a Tornos service call to a huge customer, the customer told Dulio he was trying to find some good nozzles for coolant on his machines. Dulio told him he would make some over the weekend on his machine. He returned the next week with some sample parts, but unfortunately the customer had thought he had been joking when Dulio said he would make the parts. The customer had already agreed to buy 2,500 nozzles from a vender. Though he was quite frustrated, Dulio admits it was great learning experience about the importance of being clear in business deals.

(27:40) Not long after the frustrating nozzle incident, another customer called Dulio for help on a machine. After Dulio helped him, the customer complained that he did not have enough capacity for some of his jobs. Dulio told him that he had a DECO10, and the customer gave him the opportunity to make some parts for him. Since then, the customer has given Dulio enough work for him to buy a DECO13 and DECO20 and quit his job working at Tornos.

(32:10) Dulio believes that his business has a bright future going into 2020. He says he believes that America is the land of opportunity.

Question: Is this a good time to start a machining business?

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